Wow... it's been a while since I've blogged on here. It's not that I haven't been writing, it's just that I've had some other outlets, which make the something's Dan says a little quiet.. not my normal style. October 2010 it tells me... oops


So today it is... a quiet house, a busy mind and the need to write something has made this happen.

 

I've been Recruiting for a number of years now... maybe too many, but I heard something the other day which I hadn't heard before.  Basically I'm writing to see if anyone else has had this before.

 

I had a new Recruiter pose a question to me, a moral question, which I've never thought about (and probably won't again).  His moral dilemma stemmed from the idea or perception that we were stealing people from employers.  We were without any remorse, calling employed people and talking to them about other jobs, putting the their current employers at risk.  "don't you have a moral issue with that Dan?"

 

Huh?  My response was basically, I would feel bad if there was ever a day I walked into a work place, picked someone up, against their will, walked them out the door and took them to my clients site, tied them to the desk and collected a fee.  Dog the Bounty hunter style!

 

So I put myself in the Employers, Managers shoes.  Nope still no issue!  Good or bad, people come and go from your business, and you life for a mixed bag of reasons.  Sure at times, I'll be pissed off, maybe disappointed (sometimes really really happy!) when people leave, but you know what... it's life.   Now, if someone is enticed to leave, what does that really say?  It says they weren't getting everything they needed in the first place.  You weren't (as am employer) able or willing to give them what they needed in an employer, leaving them open to be enticed away by these canny Recruiters!  So be it!

 

I've seen companies specifically target people from set organisations, it happens daily across the world I promise.  Most work places are full of people that have worked somewhere else, so I am still lost on the issue.

 

Needless to say this person has now left the industry, but I'm wondering if I'm on my own here and not getting the issue? Help.

Views: 30

Comment by Maureen Sharib on February 27, 2011 at 8:13am

You're not alone.

You get the issue.

 

That wasn't a moral question.

That was an uninformed question.

 

Let me guess.  He was uh...20-something?

;)

Comment by Christopher Poreda on February 27, 2011 at 8:59am

Before I started ultimatejobboard.com I recruited for over 10 years.  My belief then is my belief now, everyone is in the market all the time.  There is always a pain to heal; more money, better hours, shorter commute, better career advancement, better benefits, etc. As a recruiter it was my job to heal that pain to benefit my candidate and my client.

 

As for the effect of a recruiter on companies recruited from and the moral issue?  All companies our recruited from.  Your clients are targeted by other recruiting firms.  It's a life cycle and more often than not cycles are healthy.  They create change, innovation and often time reinvigorate. 

Comment by Sandra McCartt on February 27, 2011 at 11:29am
Ask this little idiot if he currently drives a ford, a Chevrolet sales person calls him, offers him an opportunity to buy a new Cheve that he likes better than his Ford would he think the Cheve. sales person was morally corrupt? Also ask him if he really thinks he has the power to "steal" people, or control people to the point that they will make a job change based solely on him talking to them. If he says yes to either of those questions send him for professional help. He either thinks he has way too much power, he will be driving a Ford forever or he has never been told no by his mommy or any person he has ever spoken to about a new job.
Comment by Valentino Martinez on February 27, 2011 at 12:53pm

On this subject, without naming names, due to my recruiting prowess I was told that I"was putting the defense of this country at risk by taking (recruiting away) highly accomplished engineers working on top secret programs...  I was told, actually threatened to stop by my counterpart at a competitor aerospace company.  She said, "I'm going to report you to the IG (Inspector General) and my director."  I asked, "What is your director's name...maybe he'll be interested in working in our top secret programs."  Noise of phone slamming down.

Dan, your dilemma brought back that memory and I have deja vu every time I see the movie, A Few Good Men when Col. Jessep said, when he was found guilty of ordering a Code RED at the end of his the court trial: "You f#*@in' people. You have no idea how to defend a nation. All you did was weaken a country today, Kaffee. That's all you did. You put people's lives in danger. Sweet dreams, son."

Yet when I do recruit top flight candidates away from the competition, then and now, I do have sweet dreams.

 

 

 

Comment by Ron Kubitz on February 28, 2011 at 1:12pm

Come on now the recruiter that asked the question was a newbie so cut him/her some slack. That being said this newbie nowhas 2 strikes against him/her in my book and unless trained up quickly is certainly in the wrong profession.

Before chastising however think back on the dumb questions/comments/recruiting calls that we all made as newbies!

Comment by Al Merrill on February 28, 2011 at 1:17pm
I recall when someone upon learning I was a headhunter, turned and said "well, you're a thief!" Today, I remember that comment every time I pick up the phone, and it still feels good!
Comment by Gay Carter on February 28, 2011 at 1:45pm
 

My former employer and mentor in this business used to respond to the "moral" question of recruiting away from an employer  . .  do they ban newspapers with  want ad job listings from the work place?  Today, it would be, do they ban the internet that promotes the latest companies hiring, ban Twitter and Facebook which workers check even while on the job, and are sources that companies and recruiters use to find candidates?  If an individual is inclined to listen to, read about or see an opportunity that interests them, they will respond indicating they are  most likely open to making a move, whether it comes from a recruiter or another source.  Some of the most savvy managers I work with, say recruiting is a way of life and if one of their staff members wants to explore an opportunity that moves their career further, it was most likely time for them to move on. Or if they are disatisfied with their job, definitely time to move on. And, guess what, those managers are usually open to listening to new opportunities as well.  And as to owners and top management, they wouldn't think twice if they decided to lay off John or Jane Doe, or outsource their positions if it was to the companies' advantage.  As to the recruiter asking the question . . . probably best that you let him or her go.  (Didn't s/he understand the job before being hired?) From my experience with new recruiter hires, that is a difficult issue to overcome, and/or a great excuse for them to stay off the phone! My guess, if you don’t let this recruiter go, it will be a very short time before he or she says goodbye! By the way, if the question pertained to recruiting people out of a company that hires from you, then my response would have been different.

Comment by Sandra McCartt on February 28, 2011 at 1:45pm

Ron, while i agree that we all did dumb stuff when we were newbies this seems to be something that should be so basic to anyone who is in any kind of sales position that this one really does not belong in recruiting or any kind of sales.  Any time anyone is selling anything they are taking business away from somebody else.  Did any of us think even when we were two days into the business that we would only be working with people who were unemployed so would never be in a position to be part of a process that moved an employee from one company to another.

 

I had a radiologist i was working with once make the comment that he didn't know how i did what i do because it seemed to him that i was making money off of people's problems.

My response:  "Are you kidding me? " "You make 300K a year telling people they have cancer.  At least i can help solve some of the problems people come to me with, you just read a CT scan tell people they have brain cancer and send them down the road."

 

He agreed that he had never thought of it that way and apologized.

Comment by Gay Carter on February 28, 2011 at 2:58pm

Al, Fun comment.  When people say that to me, I say, "yes, I'm a pirate!"  But if they feel they really need further explanation, I tell them I'm a talent scout, looking for the best talent for my hiring client.  For some reason, that seems to set better, even though I love being a "Headhunter!"

Comment by Gay Carter on February 28, 2011 at 3:00pm
Ron, the one I like best is, "Isn't there an easier way to do this, like advertising?" What do they not understand about the word, recruiter!

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